Let's talk about it.

Obviously, there is need for some change here in the FGunZ server because something is keeping us from bringing our player count back up. I'd like to talk about a few things first that I believe should change so that we can make FG great again! So lets get started, ya?

First, I'd like to talk about our current staff. Ya'll doing great especially the GMs taking on all those unban appeals and Hacker & Player reports (Kudos to you). I thought about how there might be too many GMs for a server with not many people, but then I remember that its important to have just as many opinions as possible especially when it comes to unban appeals (Something I want to talk about later on) so theres nothing wrong there. So where does the problem lie? The ETs. Don't get me wrong, its not very motivating to host an event when only 4-8 people attend throughout the day, but I still believe that ALL ETs should be hosting an equal amount of time (unless reasons given). I ask that the higher ups look into the ETs activity and make a justified decision as to whos putting the most amount of work in comparison to whos not giving any at all. I'm not trying to fight with any of the ETs, I'm just trying to prove a point. You're more than welcome to state your opinion.

Spoiler!

Heres some pictures I took throughout the day to prove the inactiveness of ETs hosting despite them being online (I dont have any pics of the ETs being online, but I'm pretty sure people have seen them around). https://puu.sh/DYTnq/a27451d2f1.jpg
https://puu.sh/DYTnj/753ef0f94c.jpg
https://puu.sh/DYTnc/0701f6c3b0.jpg
https://puu.sh/DYTmI/53b0921ff4.jpg

Secondly, I want to talk about the player count. I want to keep this server alive as well as the other 40-60 players that are active throughout the day. I propose that we first start looking into the unban appeals and be a little more lax about how they are handled. Allow me to go into detail. Theres a great difference amongst the players who have been banned from just constant general harassment to obvious hacking. I ask that those that are anything but obvious hacking or anything in violation of the ToS are reconsidered to getting unbanned. They got banned for a reason, yes, but at this point losing a player is something that this server cant afford. I spoke with some players in game (names will remain anonymous) and many agreed that they stopped/would stop playing if a friend/someone they know got banned. That is the main reason I am suggesting this. I'm not saying to unban every player that deems their outcomes as "unjustified", but I ask that more thoughts are put into each unban appeal with the thought in mind of:
-How much they wish to return to fgunz
-How major was their offense
-How their unban would impact the player count
If all this is considered and its still believed that it wouldn't be right to unban said person, then the job is simply just being done as you were supposed to.

Lastly, lets talk about where FG is, where its headed, and where it could be headed. Right now, FG is in a good place, despite the low player count. I looked upon other GunZ communities and majority of them say that FG is the best (Obviously with our admins leading us), but the question lies as why are we still sitting at 30-60 players? Its only because there are other servers with more players so that attracts more players, even if said server isnt better. Players attract players, thats all there is to it. Take up my suggestions above and we might just attract said players then shall exponentially increase in player count. So where is it headed? If no actions are taking, we'd just be stuck in this current situation for god only knows how long. It wouldn't be entirely bad, but it wouldn't be recommended either, so lets just jump into where it could be headed, ya? If this works, we could steadily increase how many players we have on daily and possibly attract the attention of new developers (to ease the tension off our current ones) and make FG great again! Now I know this all sounds naive and yea theres also the possibility that it could take a turn for the worse, but. We dont have much to lose in my suggestion. Even if unbanning some players doesn't increase the player count it could still have a more positive impact on this server. How? Well, lets be honest. A lot of people are banned for pretty silly reasons, but I wont go into detail because I'm sure most people know what I'm talking about. I believe this server can make a comeback and I'm wanting to do whatever it takes to make that happen.

Everything I said is for the sake of bringing FG back to it's former glory. Thank you for reading.

Thanks for the effort you put in the thread, got one thing to outline though:

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I'm not saying to unban every player that deems their outcomes as "unjustified", but I ask that more thoughts are put into each unban appeal with the thought in mind of:
-How much they wish to return to fgunz
-How major was their offense
-How their unban would impact the player count

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I can't agree with your last point here, how a player's unban would impact playercount should never be a factor to take into consideration when dealing with an appeal. If we did that then it would be unfair, we'd basically be saying "you're famous so we should consider unbanning you", while people who aren't wouldn't have that privilege. Can't say I'm too fond of that.

We're actually a lot more lenient with unban appeals now than we were before due to this thread last year, people have constantly accused GMs of being too lenient and saying things like:

https://i.imgur.com/fXA4Nln.png

So when it comes to unbans I think nothing needs to be changed in that aspect.

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Originally Posted by #1Chef

Thanks for the effort you put in the thread, got one thing to outline though:



I can't agree with your last point here, how a player's unban would impact playercount should never be a factor to take into consideration when dealing with an appeal. If we did that then it would be unfair, we'd basically be saying "you're famous so we should consider unbanning you", while people who aren't wouldn't have that privilege. Can't say I'm too fond of that.

We're actually a lot more lenient with unban appeals now than we were before due to this thread last year, people have constantly accused GMs of being too lenient and saying things like:

https://i.imgur.com/fXA4Nln.png

So when it comes to unbans I think nothing needs to be changed in that aspect.

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I mustve worded that wrong. Obviously, a player's fame should never be considered when doing an unban appeal. I only meant to view a possibility of having more players when said player is unbanned. In example, once one is unbanned they reach out to a friend (who potentially stopped playing since they were banned) and then so on. Obviously I'm not saying like "Go tell your friends to come to fg cause youre unbanned now", but like just the action alone should be enough to grab the attention of said friends. Sorry im kinda spinning in circles here I just have slight trouble explaining what im trying to say. All in all, I'm not asking for a complete reform of the unbans and I do get that its already more lenient as it is, but I'm more leaning towards being more lenient as to HOW they get banned. Obviously some things shouldnt be joked about and harassment is a serious thing even if its over the internet. I dont doubt any of the staff's ability to detect any hacks (although some may be more difficult to detect than others), but if even one person amongst the staff have the slightest thoughts that maybe the person making the appeal should be unbanned. I hope even that slight thought is taken to consideration.

Mate u tryna fire shots while I’m on holiday in Canada???

OT: As said many times before, we can’t forget the fact that a majority of the people not playing gunz anymore just have lives, jobs and families. I mean most of the staff started playing this game more than 10 years ago and we’re currently at an age where its difficult to maintain activity on a game like this. And yeah to keep and attract new players is difficult since GunZ is just a difficult game to get into, gotta put a lot of effort in it.

Problem with unban appeals is that probably 75% of the people lie about them using something (in case of hacking) or they bypassed their ban one or multiple times, we cannot be more lax if people lie or bypass.

Another problem is that a lot of people have grown up or started playing other games. Also, games like Fortnite have been growing massively in popularity among the young players which also impacted GunZ popularity. (since it had many young players as well, especially in certain countries)

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Originally Posted by Mike

Mate u tryna fire shots while I’m on holiday in Canada???

OT: As said many times before, we can’t forget the fact that a majority of the people not playing gunz anymore just have lives, jobs and families. I mean most of the staff started playing this game more than 10 years ago and we’re currently at an age where its difficult to maintain activity on a game like this. And yeah to keep and attract new players is difficult since GunZ is just a difficult game to get into, gotta put a lot of effort in it.

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I did say unless reasons given though smh.

OT: I know that FG isnt the first thing on people's mind when they get out of work or spend time with their families. But in the same time many friendships were created here and some still remain friends even outside of FG. I'm just trying to defend a place they can come back to to reminisce.

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Originally Posted by Dave

Problem with unban appeals is that probably 75% of the people lie about them using something (in case of hacking) or they bypassed their ban one or multiple times, we cannot be more lax if people lie or bypass.

Another problem is that a lot of people have grown up or started playing other games. Also, games like Fortnite have been growing massively in popularity among the young players which also impacted GunZ popularity. (since it had many young players as well, especially in certain countries)

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Ew fortnite. I mean yea its understandable that most people who play GunZ are more likely around 20+ yrs old at the very least, but that doesnt explain why other servers still have players. Everyone is trying to make their own private server when honestly we should all have our eyes on one and have one big server. The forum stats on FG are greater than any other server and it was the first one to catch my eye ever since Aeria (ijji) closed. Yea, some people unban appeals appear two-faced I know that just as much as the GMs. But I still strongly believe that GunZ can stay alive for a really long time because theres not really any copy for it. Its not a dead game, just outdated. I mean like look at games like Super mario maker right? Super mario world is a game older than GunZ many times over, but all they had to do was make it so that you can make your own maps and play in it freely and BAM its basically the same exact game. Any game could attract attention even if its just the most simplest, yet most requested change. I know the server may not have the manpower, but it does have the time. I have faith.

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Originally Posted by Prone

I spoke with some players in game (names will remain anonymous) and many agreed that they stopped/would stop playing if a friend/someone they know got banned.

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Well, if a player got banned because they hacked or another reason and another player (their friends) says that they'd stop / would stop because they got banned, it's their loss, not ours.

A lot of the current ET's are busy right now during summer and the Admins are aware, it's only temporary. That's why we've had Emperor host so much so credit to him for contributing more than what is his responsibility.

I mean you really have no idea what's going on in those appeals so I don't know how you can know that even some of them are banned for silly reasons. Anyways the whole "if my friend gets banned then I leave" argument is completely invalid.

Honestly, there are some ideas we've had about changes to the game, McSic has been every motivated to try make a change but these days we barely get any feedback on actual changes like the one recently with sg spread.

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Originally Posted by Dante

Well, if a player got banned because they hacked or another reason and another player (their friends) says that they'd stop / would stop because they got banned, it's their loss, not ours.

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You're missing the point. Go back and read.

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Originally Posted by Linzor

A lot of the current ET's are busy right now during summer and the Admins are aware, it's only temporary. That's why we've had Emperor host so much so credit to him for contributing more than what is his responsibility.

I mean you really have no idea what's going on in those appeals so I don't know how you can know that even some of them are banned for silly reasons. Anyways the whole "if my friend gets banned then I leave" argument is completely invalid.

Honestly, there are some ideas we've had about changes to the game, McSic has been every motivated to try make a change but these days we barely get any feedback on actual changes like the one recently with sg spread.

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I clearly said "(unless reasons given)" so I'm not trying to bash on any of the ETs at all if they got their own things going on, but its a different story when they've actually been online and don't host. I wouldnt say that the "if my friend gets banned then I leave" is completely invalid (maybe to some extent), but lets be honest here some players have a closer relationship to the staff than others and that could lead to a slight off-sided decision. Is it wrong? Yea, but its what makes us human. Its natural to have friends and you'd want to defend them if you have the power to do so right? Obviously, nobody should be taking sides and every decision should be equally considered no matter who they are. Like I said in an earlier comment, friendships were made here and something as simple as a ban could be the reason why both users would move to a different server or stop playing altogether. I'd do it for you if you got banned <3 (Not that you would get banned). Not everyone thinks the same as you do lin. Also, yes I want to give Emp lots of credit for hosting lots in the ETs stead.

Regarding the ideas that McSic presented, I get that its hard to really get feedback on changes he wants to make in the server. Perhaps the staff could make a couple notices per day when an idea is presented so that people actually notice it? Or maybe some sort of special notification to show that a poll is happening to get more opinions?

I just dont want FG to die. I mean no harm.

the game itself just died.. asdave stated above players went to play other games (especially young people) and other players just grew up enough for this game or other games.. i don't think there is a way to get this server as it was before, also not to mention the other gunz server that has daily over 200 players online and still have new players to join it so yeah as you said players attract players so they of course will decide to play a server which has more player count and it is hard (impossible) to beat that server when you only have 50 players online everyday and need to increase it to 150 at least to get over

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Originally Posted by Opeth

the game itself just died.. asdave stated above players went to play other games (especially young people) and other players just grew up enough for this game or other games.. i don't think there is a way to get this server as it was before, also not to mention the other gunz server that has daily over 200 players online and still have new players to join it so yeah as you said players attract players so they of course will decide to play a server which has more player count and it is hard (impossible) to beat that server when you only have 50 players online everyday and need to increase it to 150 at least to get over

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Hell, even a good 200ish players daily is all I really dream for. I highly doubt that we could get back to 500+ players again.

Again, you have to understand too that this game is about a decades and a half old now. The generation where we were in our teens, that gap is around the 20s+ currently meaning college, jobs, families, etc.

As stated above, it's the era of Fortnite. Apex is losing player count left and right and the other popular game is LoL that has high player count. In addition. you're talking about millions of dollars spent to advertise and market these games to the younger folks.

We are also in the era of kids who love to watch others player games. When I look around the mall, I see kids watching streams of Fortnite, LoL, just regular Youtube Videos.

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Originally Posted by Bulba

Again, you have to understand too that this game is about a decades and a half old now. The generation where we were in our teens, that gap is around the 20s+ currently meaning college, jobs, families, etc.

As stated above, it's the era of Fortnite. Apex is losing player count left and right and the other popular game is LoL that has high player count. In addition. you're talking about millions of dollars spent to advertise and market these games to the younger folks.

We are also in the era of kids who love to watch others player games. When I look around the mall, I see kids watching streams of Fortnite, LoL, just regular Youtube Videos.

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That basically sums up everything everyone else said, but thanks for your opinion.

Regarding the aspect of this thread which affects the ET, I agree that hosting for a smaller player base with limited participation is not that thrilling for some ET's, but personally, I have no problems about hosting for more or for less players (though my minimum to start is at least 6 players on blue). For this summer I try to consistently host everyday at least once (wish I could host more but I have a strenuous summer job). Yes, it is indeed fantastic that Emperor is helping us out, but that you might say can be a temporary fix, while Mike is on his vacation, and the other ET's are taking personal time or are somewhat busy (this last sentence can be a reiteration of Linzor's 1st paragraph in his reply).

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Originally Posted by Prone

I clearly said "(unless reasons given)" so I'm not trying to bash on any of the ET's at all if they got their own things going on, but its a different story when they've actually been online and don't host.

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It is disappointing to hear about this, but I hope it's because of not having enough time that the person(s) chose not to host. Then again this piece I wish to look into.


I won't discuss about the GM suggestions since its not my department, nor the telemarketing aspects of this thread.

lul just bring back the [r] [ia] tags n people will come back to their addiction

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Originally Posted by Prone

Hell, even a good 200ish players daily is all I really dream for. I highly doubt that we could get back to 500+ players again.

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i doubt that you can see the players count increasing to 200, in general this game is too old, rather than that it's not famous enough to get new players easily

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Originally Posted by -AznNinja

lul just bring back the [r] [ia] tags n people will come back to their addiction

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legit everyone who liked this comment are questers

while it is true its saddening

also I want to add this guy commented about everything from a questers perspective but nevermind he was always a training room player so his opinion is invalid but let me just SHOW you how wrong your opinion is prone..

unbanning players has never BEEN an issue to this as you can hack non stop with every hack in the history of gunz or on the otherside of the spectrum you can troll a forum mod which has NO impact on the game doesnt MAKE it unfair for players doesnt genuinely RUIN the fun of the game for others and get banned for 1-2 years with no choice but yeah haha so funny right hehe xd.


anyway if you want to revive this game if a little bit my suggestion post is the true answer listen to this and youll just have 10 people logging on just to spam events and then sit in training room for the rest of the day afk and trying to e-date catfishes allday..

your welcome for my big brain input

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Originally Posted by Traumatiser

also I want to add this guy commented about everything from a questers perspective but nevermind he was always a training room player so his opinion is invalid but let me just SHOW you how wrong your opinion is prone..

unbanning players has never BEEN an issue to this as you can hack non stop with every hack in the history of gunz or on the otherside of the spectrum you can troll a forum mod which has NO impact on the game doesnt MAKE it unfair for players doesnt genuinely RUIN the fun of the game for others and get banned for 1-2 years with no choice but yeah haha so funny right hehe xd.


anyway if you want to revive this game if a little bit my suggestion post is the true answer listen to this and youll just have 10 people logging on just to spam events and then sit in training room for the rest of the day afk and trying to e-date catfishes allday..

your welcome for my big brain input

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It doesn't matter if you're a quester, training room warrior, clan war hero, or garden tdm pro. Everyone is allowed to have an opinion in this post because nobody should be treated differently just because they are more well known amongst the community. I get that theres trolls and hundreds of hacks out there for GunZ and obviously such things should get said punishment for committing such actions. I'm not to ban anybody cause that would not only ruin the game and everything that the admins stood for, but also make the server seem desperate to the point where they'd do anything to get players back. I know right now the server is in a slightly-desperate state right now, but it would never drop so low to the point where it would ruin the gameplay for the current players that are still active.

You're welcome for my big brain response

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Originally Posted by Dante

Well, if a player got banned because they hacked or another reason and another player (their friends) says that they'd stop / would stop because they got banned, it's their loss, not ours.

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Yh but what if a popular clan has many players (which prob clanwars) ,and lets say the leader or their key player gets banned. Most if the known members in the clan would wanna quit the game along with the one banned. That then becomes 'server's' loss.

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Originally Posted by ImComming4U

Yh but what if a popular clan has many players (which prob clanwars) ,and lets say the leader or their key player gets banned. Most if the known members in the clan would wanna quit the game along with the one banned. That then becomes 'server's' loss.

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Thank you. Finally somebody who gets the point. Many thanks to you friend.

No we got the point, it's just not how the system works and we won't bend our rules for people who "knows" a lot of other people. That goes back to the point Chef was making.

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Originally Posted by ImComming4U

Yh but what if a popular clan has many players (which prob clanwars) ,and lets say the leader or their key player gets banned. Most if the known members in the clan would wanna quit the game along with the one banned. That then becomes 'server's' loss.

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To anyone that leaves cuz their ‘leader’ got rightfully banned, you a loser

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Originally Posted by Linzor

No we got the point, it's just not how the system works and we won't bend our rules for people who "knows" a lot of other people. That goes back to the point Chef was making.

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I'm not saying to bend the rules for people who know a lot of people. I mean would it be a bad thing that if someone gets unbanned that some people come back due to that? No, it wouldnt be bad. That still doesn't mean that someone who is more well known should have a more likely chance to be unbanned rather than someone who nobody knows. I feel like I keep having to repeat myself.

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Originally Posted by Mike

To anyone that leaves cuz their ‘leader’ got rightfully banned, you a loser

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Now you're just getting out of hand. Not everyone thinks the same way. Gotta see the bigger picture.

Honestly, I feel like this post is going nowhere. I stated my opinion and everyone stated theirs, but I got the responses that I asked for. Thank you for taking the time to comment.

~If anyone wanted further discuss this, please leave a PM instead of talking about it in the chatbox.

/close

Most of to people who used to play gunz are like 20+ now? They have better things to do.. I dont think we ever get the playercount we had in V7

Your point is very odd Josh, it's like you know what you wanna say but at the same time you don't know. When we get appeals from "big" players they get dealt with the same fair way that all other appeals get dealt with, if they get unbanned, good for them, if not, then they clearly didn't deserve the unban, it's that simple.

Anyway as requested, thread locked.