Third Item Slot/Counter items

[Desecration]

Suggestion type: FGunZ


Suggestion description: Third Item Slot/Counter Items

We need a third item slot, and not for extra nades. We need a third item slot that acts as a utility slot. Within the utility slot you would be allowed to use enchantments and counter items at no cost of weight. Counter items such as a gas mask to counter smoke nades, some type of counter item to for flash nades, something to counter molotovs, something that would counter nades (more so reduce damage from nades that hit you), and something to counter mines.

[StephanM]

Suggestion type: FGunZ


Suggestion description: Third Item Slot/Counter Items

We need a third item slot, and not for extra nades. We need a third item slot that acts as a utility slot. Within the utility slot you would be allowed to use enchantments and counter items at no cost of weight. Counter items such as a gas mask to counter smoke nades, some type of counter item to for flash nades, something to counter molotovs, something that would counter nades (more so reduce damage from nades that hit you), and something to counter mines.

Or maybe if we have no gasmask item model yet I could make one that grants the ability to block smoke dmg as a special item, not as a new counter slot.
Obtainable via event shop or a game mode or something.

[Desecration]

Or maybe if we have no gasmask item model yet I could make one that grants the ability to block smoke dmg as a special item, not as a new counter slot.
Obtainable via event shop or a game mode or something.

Yea that's what I was referring to with smoke nades was negating the damage dealt. Even though you hardly ever get hit with the smoke nades...

Hell, you could just label them all as rings of some sort instead of adding the third slot. Maybe have a ring that prevents you from being stunned by stun nades and mines. A "fire ring" to prevent you from taking any fire damage. Some kind of ring that reduces damage from snipers so instead of 70 damage it does like 50?

I think having it as a third slot though and not having an impact on weight is important so as to somewhat encourage other players to use them rather than avoid them all together. Try to add a new element into the game with options to counter certain things.

[Bunny]

The tradeoff between element usage and other special items like the various nades and mines is not something I believe should be changed. It's balanced in such a way that you should choose between them. An additional degree of freedom was added when 2 elements could be worn.

However, the idea of resistance to the various items in the game sounds interesting. Not for snipers and shotguns or what not, because that kind of defeats the purpose and I'm pretty sure everyone would want to take less damage from shotguns, but resistance items just for the special items. I believe there actually were resistance items in the game for the elements, but those were removed (maybe the charms?).

Either way, the third item slot could include level 1-80+donor analogous for elemental resistance, explosion resistance, smoke resistance, flash duration, and others I may have forgotten. Level 1 might be -5% damage and the donor one be -30%. This way people will also complain less about all the heavy special item users in the busy TDM rooms.

If the third item slot is frowned upon, it can also be an infuse-able item onto an equipment item. However, we then should consider elemental buffs as well, which brings us to why charms were removed shortly after they were introduced in the first place. If this gets added again, it should probably only include resistances to special items specifically, be a tradeoff between the various resistances possible, and not completely negate the special item it resists.

I don't see much point in giving these no weight, It sounds fair that someone might have to use a weight ring instead if they want to take -30% damage from something. Plus, I believe with the standard 2 shotguns+sword+meds+cat in the hat, there is an excess amount of weight one can use for this new potential item.

[Desecration]

The tradeoff between element usage and other special items like the various nades and mines is not something I believe should be changed. It's balanced in such a way that you should choose between them. An additional degree of freedom was added when 2 elements could be worn.

However, the idea of resistance to the various items in the game sounds interesting. Not for snipers and shotguns or what not, because that kind of defeats the purpose and I'm pretty sure everyone would want to take less damage from shotguns, but resistance items just for the special items. I believe there actually were resistance items in the game for the elements, but those were removed (maybe the charms?).

Either way, the third item slot could include level 1-80+donor analogous for elemental resistance, explosion resistance, smoke resistance, flash duration, and others I may have forgotten. Level 1 might be -5% damage and the donor one be -30%. This way people will also complain less about all the heavy special item users in the busy TDM rooms.

If the third item slot is frowned upon, it can also be an infuse-able item onto an equipment item. However, we then should consider elemental buffs as well, which brings us to why charms were removed shortly after they were introduced in the first place. If this gets added again, it should probably only include resistances to special items specifically, be a tradeoff between the various resistances possible, and not completely negate the special item it resists.

I don't see much point in giving these no weight, It sounds fair that someone might have to use a weight ring instead if they want to take -30% damage from something. Plus, I believe with the standard 2 shotguns+sword+meds+cat in the hat, there is an excess amount of weight one can use for this new potential item.

I vaguely remember charms but not enough to comment on them.

When I mentioned weapon resistances I really only considered snipers as they tend to be a two-three shot weapon. Otherwise everyone would just use the shotgun counter item and the rest would be useless. So if there's a sniper user in a room one can easily go to waiting room, equip the sniper "counter item" and rejoin. Pretty much, like you said, a trade off. Sacrificing the meds to reduce sniper damage from the sniper guy who keeps sniping you round after round.

However I feel like this might end up being unused by the majority of players. I just thought it'd be something fresh to add to GunZ to keep people curious.

Either way, the third item slot could include level 1-80+donor analogous for elemental resistance, explosion resistance, smoke resistance, flash duration, and others I may have forgotten. Level 1 might be -5% damage and the donor one be -30%. This way people will also complain less about all the heavy special item users in the busy TDM rooms.

I like your take on this. Elemental resistance, explosion, smoke, flash, crowd control (stun/mine), etc. Although, like you also said, maybe keep the elements out of it all together and just focus the resistances upon the specialty items. I more so just added the elements into the suggestion for it to be part of the third slot like a bonus slot? I really think elements shouldn't bear any weight already..but that's just personal opinion. I do agree that having to sacrifice a ring for extra weight for a resistance item seems fair. That or just take the elemental slot that's already provided and make that the resistance slot...

I like the idea of being able to infuse these resistances onto items as well. Maybe we can infuse elements into guns as well? Fire shotguns that cause burn damage upon contact lol. Oh boy...the possibilities within that!

[StephanM]

Yea that's what I was referring to with smoke nades was negating the damage dealt. Even though you hardly ever get hit with the smoke nades...

Hell, you could just label them all as rings of some sort instead of adding the third slot. Maybe have a ring that prevents you from being stunned by stun nades and mines. A "fire ring" to prevent you from taking any fire damage. Some kind of ring that reduces damage from snipers so instead of 70 damage it does like 50?

I think having it as a third slot though and not having an impact on weight is important so as to somewhat encourage other players to use them rather than avoid them all together. Try to add a new element into the game with options to counter certain things.

Or we add more rings so you have to change your setup per room?
Anti smoke rings and such.

Also the model I was thinking about is the CS terrorist model we have, perhaps we could apply anti smoke to that headpiece as an effect.

[Desecration]

Or we add more rings so you have to change your setup per room?
Anti smoke rings and such.

Also the model I was thinking about is the CS terrorist model we have, perhaps we could apply anti smoke to that headpiece as an effect.

The only thing is that smoke nades are hardly ever used, so it wouldn't make much sense to add only one item that can counter when the item it's countering hardly sees any use.

I really like the simplistic idea of just making all the counter items as rings though. Less work involved...however I feel as if it should have it's own slot in the setup though. So you have your normal health rings and weight rings in rings slot 1 and 2...then have the counter rings for a ring slot 3...?

But if the idea is taken serious then it would be nice to have them added as actual clothing items. Flak Jacket, Gas Mask, Sunglasses, etc. Maybe for the stuns and mines counter item it could be special shoes/boots?

But if some of the counter item ideas can't be thought up into apparel, then the ring direction might be best. Or maybe just add some kind of resistance setup/class option? idk

[Bunny]

The only thing is that smoke nades are hardly ever used, so it wouldn't make much sense to add only one item that can counter when the item it's countering hardly sees any use.

Its still realistic to implement rings that counter smoke even if theres only 1 smoke generating item, because even if it doesn't get much use, usage might increase based on lack of resistances to that specific weapon, its a balance between usefulness and counter-play

[StephanM]

The only thing is that smoke nades are hardly ever used, so it wouldn't make much sense to add only one item that can counter when the item it's countering hardly sees any use.

I really like the simplistic idea of just making all the counter items as rings though. Less work involved...however I feel as if it should have it's own slot in the setup though. So you have your normal health rings and weight rings in rings slot 1 and 2...then have the counter rings for a ring slot 3...?

But if the idea is taken serious then it would be nice to have them added as actual clothing items. Flak Jacket, Gas Mask, Sunglasses, etc. Maybe for the stuns and mines counter item it could be special shoes/boots?

But if some of the counter item ideas can't be thought up into apparel, then the ring direction might be best. Or maybe just add some kind of resistance setup/class option? idk

In the old days there were already resistance rings vs fire, ice, poison and lightning where players had to choose between those or just HP OR AP rings, we have mixed rings so personally I rather stick with new rings but no extra slots.

[Desecration]

Its still realistic to implement rings that counter smoke even if theres only 1 smoke generating item, because even if it doesn't get much use, usage might increase based on lack of resistances to that specific weapon, its a balance between usefulness and counter-play

Oh nono. I was coming from the assumption that Stephan only wanted to add in an item to counter smoke while not adding any other counter items along with it (fire, flash, nades, etc) but now that I reread it's clear that wasn't the idea. I'm all for it.

Although I do think smoke nades need to be reworked/rethought as they're very underwhelming even with the damage...but that's for a different topic.


@StephanM , I agree. Stick with new rings and no extra slots.