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  1. #1
    Freestyler

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    seems legit. Its mainly about the delay however. and back to your reply about the V tag, yes, theres something wrong with it, because you cant play clan wars (ijji, aeria) with 100 AP, what makes fgunz an exception? The meta gameplay is flowing away from the target gameplay. Also, V is bad because you dont play gunz seriously with 100 ap in 4v4 tdm. Lower AP but raise shot gun damage by raising the damage and lowering the delay, if the goal was to make people die faster and negate melee rushes, then FGunZ staff were successful. Don't you agree? (I'm being serious).

    Imagine if clanwars all caped AP to 100. You would see a decrease in the use of moving in, closing distance, and an increase in mid range - long range rs spamming. There is already a decrease in the skills of moving in, dodging bullets, instas, etc, because anti lead and v tag makes it worse along with triple reload shot, which is attained by using two shotguns whos delays are both 950 or lower. Dagger machine is a treasured skill and tactic within the dstyle community and fgunz is made to remove dstyle all together with introductions of the above. Kstyle moving in with half step or ld has a DRASTIC decrease compared to the original gunz and meta gameplay ONLY HERE is stale with a constant flow of updates built to reduce the tactics of movement, melee techniques, etc. Why do you think its so hard to win 1v2? Lots of 1v2+ onown tactics are useless here because shooting more is the focus fgunz staff has done to gameplay.

    this is a video of a 1v1, no anti lead. Lead itself drastically influenced meta gamepla to be a lot more diverse and interesting. With the introduction to anti lead, combined with the room tag V, that lowers ap to 100, extremely limit the ways to win a fight. Shotgun delay added to this just makes it worse.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=IEkvSvaqKDY
    This video shows kstylers 1v1ing and you can hear the speed of the reload shots. These players cannot rs immediately after previously doing one because of shotgun delay being over 950 and the natural delay of shotguns blocking you from doing so. How reload shot works is this: You shoot once with shotgun 1, then press reload to cut ONLY the recoil animation tha stops you from doing anything besides moving/jumping. Then switch to shotgun2 and shoot and press reload. Then switch back to gun 1 to repeat. The delay of a shotgun is not the fecoil animation stopping you from doing anything else, its delay limits how early anplayer can shoot with the gun itself. So the delay is still blocking you from shooting with the first gun regardless of you switching to other items. So when ou swotch back to first gun and try rsing again, 950 delay almost matches the speed it takes to reload shot and the delay hardly extends over the actual time it takes to perform reload shot. So by the time you switch back to first gun, you can shoot again.

    These kstylers in the video sometimes dont have an option to keep shooting because they cant for a certain time period after a full speed rs and have to defend from melee rushes and te bunch, or do it themselves or wall post to avoid being rushed to maximize their shooting output.
    When delay is lower than 950, gameplay is even more stale.

    In conclusion, i believe if the v tag raises ap to 120, and leaves hp and 125 or raises to 130 like it should be, and shotgun delay was set back to 1000, players would all of a sudden start realizing certain techniques, plays, tactics, and moves to now be a viable option in meta and gameplay in general. Players would be happier instantly and happier over time to see a natural increase in the diversity of gameplay. I miss the actual game itself, what it can be. The game gunz and it does not have to be so stale with just spam at a distance. Im tired of never getting a serious reply to these points, which some i have brought up in the past and this is probably my last shot. I've tired to show my points as clear as possible.
    Moving forward in meta gameplay diversity is better than the opposite. Players will see diversity in game rooms without needing to force it in via room tags. In the past, people here have never said anything against this. but the ones that agreed with me knew exactly why they were. I'm tired of horrible responses like "i dont see the difference" sigh... cmon gunz the duel!!


    https://youtube.com/watch?v=IEkvSvaqKDY

    I try to avoid V games now because lowering ap against limit breaker is stupid, thats one reason. One.

    EDIT: oh another thing forgot to re edit in: weapon combos that were previously effectce since the inteoduction to goldbox weapons in ijji ca possibly come back in meta and gameplay in general. By not just focusing on shotguns, and neither making these beefed up or reduced and just settin it back to normal, who knows, we might see rifle/shotgun again. As long as spray weapons are balanced out here.
    Last edited by DDaggerDD; 05-01-2014 at 01:29 AM.

  2. #2
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  3. #3
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    There are some shotguns that have delay of 1000 though? You just gotta work your way towards them.

    Also most of the time when I see a room that has [v] it's mostly a "Attack and Defend" room on Mansion, where people are using all sorts of weapons, mostly snipers though. Camping behind corners.

    Anyways, I think if they were to increase [v]; 125 HP 100 AP, a reasonable change to ap would just increase it to the same amount as hp; 125.

  4. #4
    Banned

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    Can we get some more quests in? I really like lich

  5. The following 3 users say thank you to AaLian for this useful post:

    DDaggerDD (05-02-2014), Eddie (05-02-2014), Sonji (05-01-2014)

  6. #5
    Wucas Pls's Avatar Asuka Langley Soryu

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    This is the Gunz discussion section, next person to mention anything not gunz related gets a thread ban and an infraction. I dont care if you support, disagree, or are the thread owner, this is ridiculous.

    You may have not started it but you definitely have the power not to continue writing worthless arguments about things that don't really matter.
    Last edited by Wucas Pls; 05-02-2014 at 04:39 AM.

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    DDaggerDD (05-02-2014), Sonji (05-02-2014)

  8. #6
    Ollypayy's Avatar LateDash Kiiiiiiiiinggggg

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    Originally Posted by DDaggerDD View Post
    seems legit. Its mainly about the delay however. and back to your reply about the V tag, yes, theres something wrong with it, because you cant play clan wars (ijji, aeria) with 100 AP, what makes fgunz an exception? The meta gameplay is flowing away from the target gameplay. Also, V is bad because you dont play gunz seriously with 100 ap in 4v4 tdm. Lower AP but raise shot gun damage by raising the damage and lowering the delay, if the goal was to make people die faster and negate melee rushes, then FGunZ staff were successful. Don't you agree? (I'm being serious).

    Imagine if clanwars all caped AP to 100. You would see a decrease in the use of moving in, closing distance, and an increase in mid range - long range rs spamming. There is already a decrease in the skills of moving in, dodging bullets, instas, etc, because anti lead and v tag makes it worse along with triple reload shot, which is attained by using two shotguns whos delays are both 950 or lower. Dagger machine is a treasured skill and tactic within the dstyle community and fgunz is made to remove dstyle all together with introductions of the above. Kstyle moving in with half step or ld has a DRASTIC decrease compared to the original gunz and meta gameplay ONLY HERE is stale with a constant flow of updates built to reduce the tactics of movement, melee techniques, etc. Why do you think its so hard to win 1v2? Lots of 1v2+ onown tactics are useless here because shooting more is the focus fgunz staff has done to gameplay.

    this is a video of a 1v1, no anti lead. Lead itself drastically influenced meta gamepla to be a lot more diverse and interesting. With the introduction to anti lead, combined with the room tag V, that lowers ap to 100, extremely limit the ways to win a fight. Shotgun delay added to this just makes it worse.
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=IEkvSvaqKDY
    This video shows kstylers 1v1ing and you can hear the speed of the reload shots. These players cannot rs immediately after previously doing one because of shotgun delay being over 950 and the natural delay of shotguns blocking you from doing so. How reload shot works is this: You shoot once with shotgun 1, then press reload to cut ONLY the recoil animation tha stops you from doing anything besides moving/jumping. Then switch to shotgun2 and shoot and press reload. Then switch back to gun 1 to repeat. The delay of a shotgun is not the fecoil animation stopping you from doing anything else, its delay limits how early anplayer can shoot with the gun itself. So the delay is still blocking you from shooting with the first gun regardless of you switching to other items. So when ou swotch back to first gun and try rsing again, 950 delay almost matches the speed it takes to reload shot and the delay hardly extends over the actual time it takes to perform reload shot. So by the time you switch back to first gun, you can shoot again.

    These kstylers in the video sometimes dont have an option to keep shooting because they cant for a certain time period after a full speed rs and have to defend from melee rushes and te bunch, or do it themselves or wall post to avoid being rushed to maximize their shooting output.
    When delay is lower than 950, gameplay is even more stale.

    In conclusion, i believe if the v tag raises ap to 120, and leaves hp and 125 or raises to 130 like it should be, and shotgun delay was set back to 1000, players would all of a sudden start realizing certain techniques, plays, tactics, and moves to now be a viable option in meta and gameplay in general. Players would be happier instantly and happier over time to see a natural increase in the diversity of gameplay. I miss the actual game itself, what it can be. The game gunz and it does not have to be so stale with just spam at a distance. Im tired of never getting a serious reply to these points, which some i have brought up in the past and this is probably my last shot. I've tired to show my points as clear as possible.
    Moving forward in meta gameplay diversity is better than the opposite. Players will see diversity in game rooms without needing to force it in via room tags. In the past, people here have never said anything against this. but the ones that agreed with me knew exactly why they were. I'm tired of horrible responses like "i dont see the difference" sigh... cmon gunz the duel!!


    https://youtube.com/watch?v=IEkvSvaqKDY

    I try to avoid V games now because lowering ap against limit breaker is stupid, thats one reason. One.

    EDIT: oh another thing forgot to re edit in: weapon combos that were previously effectce since the inteoduction to goldbox weapons in ijji ca possibly come back in meta and gameplay in general. By not just focusing on shotguns, and neither making these beefed up or reduced and just settin it back to normal, who knows, we might see rifle/shotgun again. As long as spray weapons are balanced out here.
    I don't see how raising AP to 120 is gonna change play style if not, at all.
    I used to cw @ ijji with like 119HP & 110AP & this was back in 09 & from judging from my experiences, gameplay is identical. The pioneer @ ijji had 1000 delay which is only 50 more then the shotguns here.

    I still move in with LD & people are still crying "get off the wall fgt" si.

    The players in the 1 v 1 are using B3-6 i don't know which ones specifically, but the main argument is that noone in their right mind would use them in CW/competitively.

    It's not hard to 2 v 1 in FGunz, you just have to play it strategically & not bum rush out there.

    The only big difference I can see is the lead acting as a catalyst for users to UC & chit. I used to cw with a few top clans & was even a sub for an Australian clan that was given a spot in the IJJI tourney. Heck I even remade an old clan with a few original members & got it to rank 7 (MOUNTAINS BEST SI) before disbanding after 1 month lma0.

    tl;dr who cares about what happened in the quest servers, this is 2014 & players are much more skilled



  9. #7
    StephanM's Avatar 🌹

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    Would bringing back the avenger be better? (the 2 ammo higher dmg shotgun)

  10. #8
    Corque's Avatar The New Guy

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    Originally Posted by StephanM View Post
    Would bringing back the avenger be better? (the 2 ammo higher dmg shotgun)
    Not in conjunction with [R] because that could be brutal.
    In op: why change the vanilla AP when it's meant to be vanilla? Defeats the object of having the tag.



  11. #9
    StephanM's Avatar 🌹

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    Originally Posted by Corque View Post
    Not in conjunction with [R] because that could be brutal.
    In op: why change the vanilla AP when it's meant to be vanilla? Defeats the object of having the tag.
    Sorry, I should've been more clear.. I ment for Clan wars.

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  13. #10
    Sonji's Avatar Dapper AF

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    Originally Posted by StephanM View Post
    Sorry, I should've been more clear.. I ment for Clan wars.
    I mean if you bring it back it would just be back in the shop anyways so yeah the reply

    Originally Posted by Corque View Post
    Not in conjunction with [R] because that could be brutal.
    In op: why change the vanilla AP when it's meant to be vanilla? Defeats the object of having the tag.
    Has a point '-'

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