How should a CW map look like?

[Tungsten]

I've been playing GunZ since it's release in the summer of 2005 and I would really like to get in on helping design this map, I'm no good at the design but I can definitely lend a guiding hand.

I forgot who said it but someone said the other maps were designed with k-style in mind --- No they weren't. The dash cancel, flip/wall cancels, butterfly and slash shots were all found out INCREDIBLY quickly, however k-style was never mentioned or found out until the game's release.

I believe a SLIGHTLY mirrored map would work WELL. Everything could be mirrored up to a certain point in the map, where it opens up to an asymmetric playing field, maybe some boxes (like in that side alley of town) off to the side people can potshot and slightly camp from, some space for people that like to flank and wall-run/wall-cancel a couple cars off to one side and maybe a train on the other, or a train running through the center with like two of those flat carts so people walk across it with no problem (the train will be slightly in the map, like a subway, and the flat cart will be raised just enough to walk smoothly over). Players could walk through the space or wall cancel over the train to fight. This creates an ideal fighting style for all people, around these boxes, the train, the running space. People are free to potshot, camp, rush, wall-run, flank and all sorts of things.

The HP/AP respawns could be back at spawn, make it take ~10-13 seconds to run back to spawn.


I think it's about time there was a map specifically designed for CW, so everything is fair, nobody complaining about which side is better to spawn at, etc.



EDIT:

I think that the texture should be changed to a color not so dark, as some players could use certain outfits/avatars to blend into the texture. I believe some type of coloring from Town or Factory would be best placed here. They are very NEUTRAL colors, not too bright like castle or too dark like dungeon (or skillmaps)

I also support the use of lightmap, I use it in archetype, feels more like a map, LOL.

[DDaggerDD]

I believe a SLIGHTLY mirrored map would work WELL.

Why do you believe a slightly mirrored map would work well?

Everything could be mirrored up to a certain point in the map, where it opens up to an asymmetric playing field, maybe some boxes (like in that side alley of town) off to the side people can potshot and slightly camp from, some space for people that like to flank and wall-run/wall-cancel a couple cars off to one side and maybe a train on the other, or a train running through the center with like two of those flat carts so people walk across it with no problem (the train will be slightly in the map, like a subway, and the flat cart will be raised just enough to walk smoothly over). Players could walk through the space or wall cancel over the train to fight. This creates an ideal fighting style for all people, around these boxes, the train, the running space. People are free to potshot, camp, rush, wall-run, flank and all sorts of things.

all this is just little design polishing options, a box there, something here, but without any explanation or prediction of what could happen with the gameplay via these ideas you gave, its just an idea. Your giving options that allow people to potshot, fight in an open field? And also be able to flank, I agree all that is important but what about do you have any comments specifically relating to the maps hell posted in this thread?

The HP/AP respawns could be back at spawn, make it take ~10-13 seconds to run back to spawn.

should time how long it takes to go from the bridge in castle, back to an hp spawn. would be a good starting point.

[Tungsten]

Why do you believe a slightly mirrored map would work well?

Everything is the same when you spawn, running into the battle, all the HP/AP/Ammo spawns EXCEPT for when you get to the actual fighting grounds, I belive if Hell took that map, and trimmed down that stuff, right where that door starts (the main one, not the side) should open into the area I described, which would be asymmetrical, boxes, cars, trucks, forklifts, the train could all be placed in random areas.

That would stop people complaining about certain spawn points can rush quicker to the battle because they're both exactly the same distance and the battle area is big enough to fight in all different environments, whether you potshot/camp or rush/flank or a combination of the two.

all this is just little design polishing options, a box there, something here, but without any explanation or prediction of what could happen with the gameplay via these ideas you gave, its just an idea. Your giving options that allow people to potshot, fight in an open field? And also be able to flank, I agree all that is important but what about do you have any comments specifically relating to the maps hell posted in this thread?

Exactly, like someone said before, there should be a group of people specifically recruited to help test out maps and other big things implemented into the game. Some who have played since the beginning, some from the middle, some who are brand new, some who play casually and some who play 90 hours a week. That way we can gauge an EVEN medium of all areas of the varying player spectrum.

should time how long it takes to go from the bridge in castle, back to an hp spawn. would be a good starting point.

My thoughts exactly.

I just timed it from myself. It takes about 9.5 seconds to run from blue spawn to the AP spawn in the center of bridge, and 12 seconds to get to the spawn on the side

[DDaggerDD]

well, i did say a goodbye i guess but, ill just finish up here. Don't mirror whole maps unless making an attack defence type game on purpose in clan war, you can think about mirroring battle fields, where players fight, but not full maps. You can think about making it equal distance to reach battle fields in start round, but dont mirror a whole map. Imagine if both teams in town had a bunker near their base? Promoting stalemate fight situations, get me? Both teams will be able to run to their "safe camp zone" but you have to remember, a lot of the playing, especially when it gets more advanced, is about who makes it first to a certain point, which team has more map/area control. Get me? The game is a lot more fun when you are fighting over the bunker rather than both sides having one. Don't mirror both sides pls god =/.

Imagine an open space, blank field. and there is 1 car in the middle of the map and 2 players are 1v1ing. 1 Player goes behind the car and potshots or reloads, the other is in a bad situation. What if there was another car? Then both sides can reload and camp/pot shot against each other? Its about fighting, fighting for things, fighting over that 1 hp spawn, etc. Stuff like that. The map has to be able to put players in all situations, and it comes down to the players choices, do i rush or not? Oh wait, i have a ****ing car to camp behind too.

In town theres that 1 car near the clock, but it doesnt really matter how u make a "battle field" (note not talking about a full map), as long as there is cover, open space, elements of everything, players will make the necessary choices. Just go freestyle and do whatever you want with a map, make a map based on creativity and looks, then go from there with play testing and balancing, but mirroring a whole map isnt a good start.

-----------------------POST 2---------------------------

Title: Be free with your map Creation (not too free ofc) & The reason why we think we must "balance out maps"

Ill note some imbalances with current clanwar maps so you have an idea hellsniper of what not to do:

Town: The team near the bunker takes longer to reach the clock (obviously) or even just the general open playing field.
1. It comes down to how many exists, entrances and pathways you have from the battle field back to your base in the start round. This is because if you rush towards the battle field and only have one way to move, either forward into a shower of bullets straight into the enemy team, or back towards where you came. Note this is start round, starting a battle team vs team. The team in Town starting near the bunker can usually and almost only make it just past the firetruck near their base. They get pinned and their flanks are open to enemy fire from the opposing team because of the other team's starting point. This team near the bunker only has one pathway to retreat, back to base, then to up stairs to bunker. Flanking for this team, they must go around for a very long time to reach the clock. The other team just has way too many pathways for entering the battle field, and exiting lol. But this is not a flaw.

I dont think maps really have flaws. I think the meta gameplay is what is flawed and we have been thinking all this time in a way to cater towards meta gameplay, K-Style team gameplay and what not. There are so many other weapons, there are so many possible strategies for the team starting near the base to easily flank using a D-Styler to go around, one that can E-Lunge chain (its a move, when a lunge is animation frozen), or just do 10/10 e lunges to flank around. Meta gameplay restricts what game developers can do with GunZ. Just balance out the game like I said, if a tag is being used such as SGO for shotgun only because the meta players dont like other guns, its because they think they're unbalanced and dont take as much skill and experience as they have put it. Fix the game. And be free with ur map creativity. Ofc there are obv things that can be flawed but just be free, then test. simpo. A mirrored map for both team sides will only lead to one entrance to a battle field, the same routes being used, the same gameplay, idk, gonna be lame after a while. watchh

[DDaggerDD]

?? bump

[ben105]

something like blitzkrieng wat matters is that the map should be big

[Wucas Pls]

im jus waiting for a response to my post lol.

The map is currently being tested by some users, changes will be made after that point.

[DDaggerDD]

The map is currently being tested by some users, changes will be made after that point.

I c, I could help but all good if u guys got enuf ppl, also, im jus waiting on a reply from my posts, not just the one on this page.

[HellSniper]

Im throwing around designs and layouts.
First few posts/images where mere examples of what could be.

[DDaggerDD]

Im throwing around designs and layouts.
First few posts/images where mere examples of what could be.

ik, still waiting on reply 2 see what you guys think about my points relating to cw maps