Religion

[Taint]

I quit halfway watching this because of the poor English. All I got from it was him not agreeing with the first version of the bible. Someone who doesn't agree with another persons religion is fine, convincing other people of your own religion is wrong, convincing other people that some religion doesn't make sense or is incorrect is even worse. Going public via youtube, presentations, disrespecting the (what for others is holy) bible and it's followers is Pathetic with a capital P.

Religion is very simple and should stay that way, people should believe whatever they want to believe and stick with it. They can come together, sing their songs and pray to their gods as much as they want. The only point where it goes wrong it this form of discussion is when you start to convince other people of what you think is right or wrong.

So reading that title, watching the first 2 minutes already tells me enough that anyone actually believing a word that guy says is too pathetic to carry it's own opinion. I guess that is fine for the ones that like to follow others.


As far as the birth of religion goes, I think it is something of the past. People tend to seek reasoning behind actions that occur, and at this point of time most of the things we see, feel, hear or experience in any other way are scientifically explainable. As for the past, the tools and knowledge weren't there to prove things that happened weren't caused by powers from above. I think we all had points in time that something happened that you couldn't explain, I personally find it the most frustrating kind of thing that can happen, and I believe that when that happened 2000 years ago, stories were made. I don't know every chapter in the bible or any other religious books but from what I've read and heard most of it was a way of life. Put those stories in books and add a convincing speech and people will start to believe you.

I think you can kind of compare it to all the diets that are out there right now, there is a lot of discussion on what kind of diet would be good and which wouldn't be. We have been growing up without actually knowing what kind of food we eat every day, what it does to our bodies and how to live perfectly healthy. The products we can buy aren't the ones we could find in nature and food you order is often far from 100% natural. People get fat, people want to lose weight but 99% of humanity didn't study or research actual facts on food. So what do they do? They follow some person's diet. Whether that is from some book, website or some person you know in real life that doesn't matter. You follow something, you get results and you accept that that's the way to lose weight and become 'healthy'. Both in religion and diets there are quite a few different thoughts and books on how to achieve / live your life. Now diets don't (at least not yet) cause wars all over the world, but they cause arguments and indifferences as much as religion can do, simply because people will believe what they want to believe.

And to get back to the scientific subject, if we encounter issues right now we can just google a solution. Doesn't matter if you have issues with yourself or other people there is almost always an answer on the internet. I believe the internet didn't excist 2000 years ago, so what do you do when you get sick without having a doctor? What do you do if you seek answers on the many questions you have? You need some kind of grip on life, something to hold on to, something that tells you that you live a good life and that everything will be fine, at some point. I believe that desire from humans allowed religion to grow that big. And I believe science is overruling religion sorta.

Food for thoughts



This is where you are wrong, You don't use your religion to do so, but many do. Don't be naive, everybody knows it's happening all over, I have experienced it plenty of times myself. It might happen as often in the places you come, but the muslims I see in our big cities certainly aren't as nice of a muslim as you are. And they do base their aggression towards other religions, gay or any other type of 'different' person on their religion

If you read what I said earlier in the chatbox or understood what I meant by 'nohatepls' it meant I'm not forcing anyone to believe that my own religion is true, hence why I said nohate, and also how am I naïve? I never tried to convince anyone to convert, everything I typed down(almosteverything) gets back fired at me making me look like I'm the bad person when my intention was never to offend or insult anybody, I also meant that lemonish shouldn't use religion to explain his own anger and express it that way by blaming religion

[slugheady]

Not a small portion, The majority of LARGE establishments make an insane amount of money (that is tax free for some stupid reason). Well I dont know how much this applies to your area but think about the biggest church/mosque in your state/province and imagine 1-2 thousand people going through it daily. I think 1-2k might be a bit low but lets just go with it. Imagine if 50% of them are devout enough to donate, I know that in Islam you have to give a percentage of your wealth, monthly, Christianity also requires/encourages you to donate but I dont think it is as commonplace to donate as it is in Islam. Just think about all of that money, not to mention the insane amount of tax benefits of running a religious establishment.

There are still places that focus on religion and their god's teachings but I think most of the bigger establishments are in it for nothing but the money.

Yeah, in that regard you're right. But the ones that profit from all of that are just a small portion of the entire religious human. But there is more to it then just that profit you're talking about. I don't know to how many different countries or cities you've been, but if you like culture then you've seen the enormous churches in there as well. They sure do cost money. Not too long ago, the church my girlfriend used to go to had to be closed because they didn't receive enough donations in order to maintain the building. And that was just a small one. Yeah you're most likely right that a lot of money is being wasted on the wealth for a few, but don't just point black call the majority profiteers.

[MadameDeath]

Yeah, in that regard you're right. But the ones that profit from all of that are just a small portion of the entire religious human. But there is more to it then just that profit you're talking about. I don't know to how many different countries or cities you've been, but if you like culture then you've seen the enormous churches in there as well. They sure do cost money. Not too long ago, the church my girlfriend used to go to had to be closed because they didn't receive enough donations in order to maintain the building. And that was just a small one. Yeah you're most likely right that a lot of money is being wasted on the wealth for a few, but don't just point black call the majority profiteers.

I call the majority of large establishments profiteers, and I still stand by this statement.

But in terms of all religious buildings out there, this is most likely not a huge majority because there are a lot of great small establishments out there. The small establishments are starved for money BECAUSE of the larger establishments. The church your girlfriend went to was most likely in the vicinity of a larger church that was "sucking up" all of the funds of the populations, just a guess.

[slugheady]

If you read what I said earlier in the chatbox or understood what I meant by 'nohatepls' it meant I'm not forcing anyone to believe that my own religion is true, hence why I said nohate, and also how am I naïve? I never tried to convince anyone to convert, everything I typed down(almosteverything) gets back fired at me maiing me look like I'm the bad person when my intention was never to offend or insult anybody, I also meant that lemonish shouldn't use religion to explain his own anger and express it that way by blaming religion

I'm also referring to this, as in the naive part.

that's where you're wrong, religions dont target people (at least in mine) we don't target anybody even the homosexuals, it is said that its wrong and what not but we as heterosexuals we werent told to hate and beat up gay people for being who they are, am i right? have you seen a muslim in the street calling out a man who's different in his sexual orientation? because i havent Oo

As said before, this most likely doesn't happen as often in the places you come but it does happen in a lot of other places. I can bring up examples on how things go in here, but you're just going to have to trust me that young Muslim adults are harassing people here in Holland for being gay, lesbian and whatnot. That is why I'm saying you're naive, I quote once again "Religions don't target people (at least in mine)". You don't, but others in your religion do, and use their religion to back up their reasoning.

As for the nohatepls, I couldn't bare not responding to that ridiculous video, as I explained. I feel it's convincing other people of religion and making others look bad. I'm not hating you for posting it, I am however telling you to reconsider posting stuff like that next time since it'll look like you're behind everything the guy says, in spite of that being true or not. And don't feel like everything is being thrown back at you, it's a discussion and people agree and disagree. People who agree with you won't say shit and people who don't will argue, that's the way it works.

[Lorrainé]

I call the majority of large establishments profiteers, and I still stand by this statement.

But in terms of all religious buildings out there, this is most likely not a huge majority because there are a lot of great small establishments out there. The small establishments are starved for money BECAUSE of the larger establishments. The church your girlfriend went to was most likely in the vicinity of a larger church that was "sucking up" all of the funds of the populations, just a guess.

You can't say majority, some religions probably get donated money by their adherents by free-choice. Believe me. I understand where you are coming from at the time of the the Martin Luther creating the "95-theses" as he was a theologian which separated the Roman Catholic Church and was the beginning of the Christian variant 'Protestantism" where Christians would trade money for indulgence in order to reach to heaven or whatever in the 1500's (which isn't true about the whole heaven part), but still happened... Like I have stated before, scripts have been commonly edited since it had been hand-downed to many people...

[Vickachu]

Religious believes can block scientific progress. for example alot of people dont "believe" in evolution for religious reasons while its scientific fact. That is one of the reasons why i think religion is harmfull.

other reasons are that relgious believes can generate alot of hate towards ohter people. just look at the middle east. but also in the US: westboro baptist church.
religion is often used as excuse to hide behind when they are criticized. "No hate please". and that way they try to silence and censor all the critique. stupid and hatefull ideas should always be criticized (religious or not).

[Wucas Pls]

Religious believes can block scientific progress. for example alot of people dont "believe" in evolution for religious reasons while its scientific fact. That is one of the reasons why i think religion is harmfull.

other reasons are that relgious believes can generate alot of hate towards ohter people. just look at the middle east. but also in the US: westboro baptist church.
religion is often used as excuse to hide behind when they are criticized. "No hate please". and that way they try to silence and censor all the critique. stupid and hatefull ideas should always be criticized (religious or not).

You are using extremists to make your point, that is a very slippery slope. I could say that since Stalin was a atheist that he had no respect for human life so bam, there goes the lives of 60 million Russians; I could say that atheism is the reason Mao Zedong attributed to the death of 67 million Chinese people. Most people don't even recognize the Westboro Babtist Church as a sect of Christianity, let alone as a shining example of what religion is; You might as well put them right in line with The Branch Davidians or Jonestown.


As for Religion being harmful to science I firmly disagree. Science is the study of questioning every probable outcome, of proving something doesn't work, and in that respect is not religion perfect? Religion has driven scientist to study the stars, the earth, and life itself if only to change the assumptions of the public. If there were not people to question every theory made, we would be set thousands of years.

This debate is not about atheism being better than religion or Islamic beliefs being more solid than Christianity, it is about principle. Religion is a decision made by every single individual on a fundamental and moralistic level, it becomes not only a choice, but a reason for living. People continually argue over sexism, sexualism, or racism, over wealth, education, and livelihood, but when it comes to religion the most liberal minds freeze and begin to question "why" and "how". I do not understand this at all. Why do we segregate each other based on these individualistic beliefs and understandings. I may not believe in the same teachings as Buddhist, but why should that change how I view him as a person. His beliefs are his concern and not my own.


Summary: If you want my opinion on religion then I can give it to you in a single sentence, "If everyone just accepted that their beliefs are as unique as their fingerprint the world would be a much better place."

Instead of arguing over whether John should eat pork or not, how about we collectively do something we all can agree on, like I don't know, curing kids with cancer or something.

[Amzz]

How did a religion start? A religion is basically just a group of people who believe in something, whether it's a myth or not.
I guess some people just like to be part of a group.

Now my personal opinion about religions is that I don't see the point of it. It's all a bunch of made up stuff and stories.
Also I hate the fact that many people are usually forced to their religion as a baby/young child.

I also think it's stupid that you are not allowed to do or eat certain things because of your religion or in some cases that it can change your point of view on something.


That doesn't mean that I think about a person differently because of his/her religion, as long as you don't bother me about it I'm totally okay with it.

K well In my religion we can't eat pork and do sex before marriage and lots of other stuff. However there are perfectly good explanations for each thing we can't do.
Also not trying to argue cuz i read the second part just explaining why we have these rules set.

Taint, this man is basically making mockery upon the Christian community and as I recall he was defending himself against a 'Christian' that has not read the bible... I can point out a few things from the Qu'ran from what I have read which really confused me as they say it is a religion of peace. Not trying to start a war but honestly, as I have studied that there are two major variants of the Muslim religion. The Shia's and the Sunni's. I have a lot of Muslim friends and we have certain discussions. Can you please explain this:

Qur'an (5:51) - "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."

I've spoken to my Sunni friends about this quote. I asked them what is it in the middle east that cause commotions between Christians and Jews. In other words, why are there so many civil wars or bombings etc... Why is it in the Qu'ran it says such statements if you claim yourselves to be the religion of peace? And for those Christians which don't know/have studied Christianity and use the religion as a title to cover up for their 'mistakes' shouldn't be involved in this conversation. I'm interested in your response. (No hate)

The Quran is not easy to interpret. There are many different speculations on lots of differnet Aya'. How ever most people refer to the hadiths (Talks) about these aya's
I think god is saying christian and jews cannot be guided... however im im not sure exactly.

I must point out another thing for others to understand. Every scripture in every religion has most likely been edited over these past 2k years or so... Just saying.

I dont know about this tbh. You can't be sure that they were edited but you also cannot be sure that they weren't.

If there were like the first two people such as Adam and that girl, shoudn't they have done incest and isn't that wrong.

There's a whole story to go with the whole Adam and Eve story. I think it's differnet for each religion idk.

[Wucas Pls]

If there were like the first two people such as Adam and that girl, shoudn't they have done incest and isn't that wrong.

If God theoretically created Adam and Eve they would be "perfect" from a medical standpoint and as such, incest would not be a problem. After many generation mutations and differences in humans would slowly deteriorate these "perfect" genetics, and as such, causes problems today.

Even in modern day cases, incest between siblings only causes complications in 1/20 births and very few of these complications are life threatening.

Honestly, if incest really caused that many problems anyone with European ancestry would be either dead or riddled with birth defects. In medieval times incest between cousins and in some cases even close family, was common to keep blood "pure" between families.

TL;DR: Incest was not banned by Judaism or Christianity until Moses came along and said it was a nono. By this time the genetic code of humans was mutated to the point that incest could cause problems ffor future generations (also by this time, there were enough humans so that incest was not needed to further reproduction).

[Irahnik]

If God theoretically created Adam and Eve they would be "perfect" from a medical standpoint and as such, incest would not be a problem. After many generation mutations and differences in humans would slowly deteriorate these "perfect" genetics, and as such, causes problems today.

Even in modern day cases, incest between siblings only causes complications in 1/20 births and very few of these complications are life threatening.

Honestly, if incest really caused that many problems anyone with European ancestry would be either dead or riddled with birth defects. In medieval times incest between cousins and in some cases even close family, was common to keep blood "pure" between families.

TL;DR: Incest was not banned by Judaism or Christianity until Moses came along and said it was a nono. By this time the genetic code of humans was mutated to the point that incest could cause problems ffor future generations (also by this time, there were enough humans so that incest was not needed to further reproduction).

[11:26:25 PM] Wucas Warren: .... I think I just accidently condoned incestuous relationships
[11:26:25 PM] Wucas Warren: woops